THE TAPROOM 2

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  • #27098
    Gildor
    MMP Elder

      well when it comes to comparing GW and mithril…. it’s a subjective matter…. I don’t know all the gw range, though I know all the M range, and while I agree that some M figurines are quite “naff”, I can’t think of any mithril figurine which would be “naffer” than the most well-sculpted GW one, but indeed that’s only my personal point of view and maybe I have not seen “superb” gw figurines but since GW isn’t “realistic sculpting”… I simply can’t like them :(

      #27099
      Barliman
      Participant

        Very subjective, as you say Master Elf – beauty is in the eye of the beholder. And of course, the whole issue pivots anyway on the visualisation of the figures – The Man’s designs are ultimately the product of ICE/MERP’s visualisation of Middle-earth, whereas GW’s are derived either from the Weta designs or GW’s own visualisers, who are (to put it politely) fairly definitely insane.

        I personally dislike a great deal of the ICE/MERP version of Middle-earth, which has at least as many flaws as the Weta/Peter Jackson version. Consequently many of the faults of such figures as these companies produce are the fault of the original visualisers, not the sculptors. This is why I prefer to consider each figure on its own merits, whether Mithril or GW.

        #27100
        Gildor
        MMP Elder

          well I don’t think it comes from that alone…. though you may be right on one aspect

          but I also dislike Citadel, Warhammer, and Warhammer 40K
          while I like Prince August roman, celtic, or phaeton designs… and also like Andrea 54mm, or Pegaso Models but totally dislike Andrea 32mm.

          as I said, it is mainly a sculpture matter. it being “realistic”, or “fantasy” sculpture

          #27101
          Barliman
          Participant

            …And therein lies the “eye of the beholder” element of the equation. For myself, I default to what I’ve already said – I prefer to remain open-minded and not condemn an entire company’s output wholesale.

            #27105
            Gildor
            MMP Elder

              I do not condemn them (though on the marketing aspect of games workshop, there would be a lot to say .. and to condemn..)

              :) I just say I don’t like them myself, you are right… the eye of the beholder :)

              #27106
              Barliman
              Participant

                Their marketing policy is bizarre. Have you seen the price of their Hobbit-based releases? £30 for a box of six PLASTIC cavalry, £12 for a single RESIN figure, and £25 for a foot and mounted figure combo? Who are they expecting to buy them at those sorts of prices? In addition the quality of their resin castings is questionable, though I’m told they’re gradually improving.

                I think they may have shot themselves in the foot with these greedy prices, since they must surely have alienated their traditional teenage market. If so, I’ve little sympathy.

                #27107
                Thingol
                Participant

                  … 2 interesting opinions…. hm… between those two I’m sure in 2 (in secondary selection) … all of those are very subjective but I sill more like ICE/MERP’s visualisation of Middle-earth… figures resemble more (ME) worldly

                  #27122
                  ddaines
                  Participant
                    Barliman wrote:
                    Their marketing policy is bizarre. Have you seen the price of their Hobbit-based releases? £30 for a box of six PLASTIC cavalry, £12 for a single RESIN figure, and £25 for a foot and mounted figure combo? Who are they expecting to buy them at those sorts of prices? In addition the quality of their resin castings is questionable, though I’m told they’re gradually improving.

                    I think they may have shot themselves in the foot with these greedy prices, since they must surely have alienated their traditional teenage market. If so, I’ve little sympathy.

                    And did you see a couple of weeks ago on the BBC internet news – the story may have had a wider distribution – that GW wanted to claim copyright on the term Space Marine – not sure if this was shoved up their celestial ‘arris, but what next, the exclusive use of the word Mithril?:o

                    #27124
                    Gildor
                    MMP Elder

                      well indeed i know you’re joking but it seems that actually Mithril is not a trademarked word… so everybody can use it

                      #27125
                      ddaines
                      Participant
                        Gildor Inglorion wrote:
                        well indeed i know you’re joking but it seems that actually Mithril is not a trademarked word… so everybody can use it

                        Certainly not joking about the Space Marine terminology Gildor :), that was real enough and I wish I had put the link on the board – it would have been good for a laugh or two, even though the potential implications……. 😎

                        #27126
                        ddaines
                        Participant

                          Here it is…… :rolleyes: minus the headline style text and associated images!!!!

                          http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-21380003

                          Row blows up over ownership of ‘space marine’ term Games Workshop is best known for its tabletop wargames Continue reading the main story
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                          UK toymaker Games Workshop has been criticised for asserting a trademark claim to the phrase ‘space marines’.

                          The claim emerged when it was used to get an American ebook about the futuristic soldiers taken off Amazon.

                          Science fiction writers have called the firm “absurd” for saying it has a trademark to the use of the term in fiction.

                          A UK media lawyer said more and more firms were using trademark law to protect their creations.

                          Generic term

                          The row started in December 2012 when US writer Maggie Hogarth found out that her novel called “Spots the Space Marine” had been removed from the Amazon ebook store following a complaint from Games Workshop.

                          In emails sent to Ms Hogarth this week, Games Workshop claims that its entry into digital publishing gives it a “common law trademark claim” over the phrase.

                          Ms Hogarth wrote a blogpost about the row and expressed her fear that if Games Workshop started actively pursuing its claim, science fiction could lose one of its “fundamental” ideas. Ms Hogarth said a lack of funds meant she was unable to defend herself against the claim. However, she is now in touch with the Electronic Frontier Foundation, which campaigns on digital rights, about the case.

                          The blogpost received a huge amount of publicity and has provoked responses from best-selling SF authors Cory Doctorow, Charles Stross and John Scalzi. Many people sent messages to Games Workshop’s Twitter account using the #spacemarines hashtag criticising the firm.

                          Continue reading the main story

                          Start Quote
                          If you have a registered trademark you can stop people using it in the course of trade for goods that are not yours or licensed or approved by you”
                          End Quote
                          Susan Hall

                          DWF

                          Mr Scalzi, who is currently president of the Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers of America, said it was “absurd” for the firm to claim ownership of the phrase and its use in literature. In a blogpost, Mr Scalzi said it was “pretty damn generic” long before Games Workshop began using it to describe its toy soldiers and in tabletop games,

                          A spokesman for Games Workshop said it had a “blanket policy” of not talking to the media and had no comment to make about the row or its trademark claim.

                          Media and intellectual property lawyer Susan Hall from DWF said Games Workshop might struggle to assert its trademark claim in America.

                          “In the US they’ll come straight up against the First Amendment and that’s one issue they’ll have to overcome,” she said.

                          Ms Hall said Games Workshop could launch a similar protection campaign in Europe as it had had a registered trademark for the term “space marine” since 1995. Its trademark claim covers the use of the word in connection with many aspects of tabletop gaming and video games, she said, but also extended to published works.

                          “If you have a registered trademark you can stop people using it in the course of trade for goods that are not yours or licensed or approved by you,” she said. “It puts the person with the mark in a very strong position.”

                          Many firms, she said, were registering trademarks to help them keep control of intellectual properties that were now out of copyright. There were dangers in this bid for control, said Ms Hall.

                          “You need strong IP laws,” she said, “but you need to have the ability to rub up against those in a way that allows people to be creative and allows creative freedom.”

                          #27127
                          Barliman
                          Participant

                            I daren’t say anything in case I get sued for calling anybody “a bunch of arses”.

                            #27129
                            sevlag
                            Participant

                              Masters, Do you know the products of this website? I find their creations very detailed and beautiful:
                              http://www.tabletop-world.com/merchantsHouse.php

                              #27130
                              Barliman
                              Participant

                                Ah yes, someone bought these to our attention some months ago. These are excellent models indeed. They’re arguably too “High Medieval / Gothic” for Middle-earth, but I still like them. And thanks for bringing them to our attention again – because I see they’ve released some more models since I last looked – including a stone windmill, which I’ve been trying to find an example of for ages! I’ve just ordered one, and will report back at some point to tell you how good the actual kit is.

                                #27131
                                sevlag
                                Participant

                                  Thank you very much Master Barliman. I thought that I had found this information here ;):P… I put it in my favorites and had forgotten it.
                                  I had noticed their cottage, which would allow me to try their creation and I have seen as a good cottage for Tom Bombadil, but I fear that make a little small, what do you think about this ?
                                  http://www.tabletop-world.com/cottage.php

                                  #27132
                                  Barliman
                                  Participant

                                    Another excellent model – full of character. Tom obviously needs to do some work on the roof before Goldberry has another washing day, or else there will be a river running down the stairs and out the front door!

                                    #27133
                                    sevlag
                                    Participant

                                      Thanks for the idea ;)

                                      #27140
                                      Thingol
                                      Participant
                                        sevlag wrote:
                                        Thank you very much Master Barliman. I thought that I had found this information here ;):P… I put it in my favorites and had forgotten it.
                                        I had noticed their cottage, which would allow me to try their creation and I have seen as a good cottage for Tom Bombadil, but I fear that make a little small, what do you think about this ?
                                        http://www.tabletop-world.com/cottage.php

                                        …. one and only croatian small company for producing products like that…. :) they produce great diorama accessories….

                                        #27141
                                        Barliman
                                        Participant

                                          Yes, but I may have already encountered my first snag buying the windmill, which is to do with cost. When I ordered it this morning I thought Croatia was already part of the EU, but I find that it doesn’t “officially” become a member until July. I may therefore have to pay the UK’s exorbitant handling charges for goods coming from outside the UK – as much as €20 for this order.

                                          I may be lucky and these charges may have already been dropped, or perhaps our Customs & Excise bloodsuckers might not notice it arriving, so we’ll see. If I’d thought about it sooner I’d have delayed ordering until July!

                                          #27142
                                          sevlag
                                          Participant

                                            This morning I also wanted to order the cottage, but for an object at 26€ they took me 13€ for postage. I’ll wait a bit.

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