THE TAPROOM 2

This topic has 3,998 replies, 33 voices, and was last updated 11 years, 4 months ago by Barliman.

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June 27, 2013 at 8:10 pm #28160
Thingol
Participant
😆 than MS should be MMS !
June 27, 2013 at 11:02 pm #28161
xenophile
Participant
Barliman wrote:

But why “MM” I wonder?

I’m not familiar with the current ranges but assuming the knowledgeable folk here would have spotted any such significance, I’d speculate it might be technical (a different alloy perhaps?) or to do with a change to the licensing?
June 28, 2013 at 12:45 am #28163
cameosis
Participant
Barliman wrote:

Yes, but what I meant was what is the point of changing it at all?

M-ake M-oney (M-ore and M-ore)
June 28, 2013 at 7:30 am #28165
Milo
Participant
😆
June 28, 2013 at 7:54 am #28167
Turambar
Participant
. . . so our dear Master Elf have to change the database . . .
June 28, 2013 at 8:04 am #28168
Milo
Participant
It might be only a database issue (prefix for miniatures reference requesting 2 characters…).
June 28, 2013 at 9:54 am #28169
imisel
Participant
Please, put on table a pint (or two.. .Well in fact anything he can drink!!!) of ale for Master Milo…. Thanks to his nice job, I was able to get PM1 at last. Without his amazing help I could NEVER, ABSOLUTELY NEVER finished my Mithril Collection (well and with the help of somebody nice guys around here, I don’t forget you).

Yves, you’re a great guy and an example of friendship and generosity for every Mithril Collector. You’re the best, man

Nowadays, the only mini I’m really looking for in this moment is the unfaithfull MS532 (I still waiting to get my order someday….) and the so-long-delayed Phaeton Vignettes. I’ve bought The Arkenstone vignette, but now I’m over with Mithril range for a while. If fact, I haven’t bought the last MS minis and they will be “on waiting line” for one year or so. You know, fiancee pressure is getting bigger about our home free space (and money!) with the home improvement works .

This doesn’t mean that I get out of Mithril, of course. It’s not a farewell, I cannot simply go away from all of you after this fantastic last years. I can’t believe how many Mithril fans are still around after all this years, when I start collected in early nineties, and how all of you keep the flame burning. So I will keep in touch with this forum and Mithril forum, and after Stella (my fiancee) and I get more stablished in our home, I hope I could get back to collect, and paint minis .

Best Regards,

Imisel / Chema
June 28, 2013 at 10:01 am #28170
Barliman
Participant
Never fear, Master Imisel, your bar tab will be waiting for you when you return. But all the best to you in the meantime.
June 28, 2013 at 1:09 pm #28173
Thingol
Participant
Hi Master Caster it is nice to se you… please drink one drink with me in this dusty inn… full of happy and lucky passers and mithril collectors… cheers !

It is always nice to read such beautiful words of praise Master Imisel !
June 28, 2013 at 1:10 pm #28174
Milo
Participant
Merci for the drink. A gallion will be enough for me today.

I’m glad I could help. In fact, it’s something I really enjoy more and more.
Cheers Chema! 😆
June 28, 2013 at 1:13 pm #28175
Thingol
Participant
Hi Master Milo… I should send you pictures of conversion the [mith]M61[/mith]

……………. cheers… !

Is it possible to eat third breakfast Master innkeeper… if it is.. one for me and another one for my hobbit friend from France…. please !
June 28, 2013 at 1:24 pm #28176
Milo
Participant
I’m curious to see what came out from your imagination Master Thingol.
June 29, 2013 at 1:14 pm #28183
hsf62
Participant
Cheers Master Thingol! Always relaxing to have a drink nwith you.
June 29, 2013 at 1:35 pm #28185
Barliman
Participant
From the number of times you’ve popped in lately, Master Holger, should I assume you’ve been banned from your local?
June 29, 2013 at 9:55 pm #28193
Gildor
MMP Elder
xenophile wrote:

Barliman wrote:

Thank you for the very clear explanation, Master X – worth a pint any day. I’ve certainly seen shrinkage on Mithril figures in the past – I have two half-orcs I bought years ago of which one is like a starved or squeezed version of the other, which would seem to match Master Gildor’s observations re the Bilbo + Arkenstone set.

Ah, this reminds me that there is another possbile reason for one figure to seem smaller than another. Shrinkage will normally make the figure smaller in all dimensions. A figure which appears squashed in one direction may have been cast with the mould under too much pressure, so that the cavity is compressed and hence the casting is thinner than intended.

And thanks for the pint!

Back on this matter, as I received information from Chris. he is very worried and upset as the figurines he sculpted match perfectly the “original” versions of Thranduil, Bard, Bilbo, captain of Aradhrynd. I sent hims pics of comparison, I hope the quality will be high enough for him to see the difference…but it is hard to see it in pics, you “feel” it when you have the figurines in your hands.

his explanation would be :
I can only speculate at this stage that, from the information that you have given me about the look of the metal , that they are using a different metal. If this has a higher melting point ( which from the fact that you say the detail is good seems to be the case) then the mould would be spun under a higher pressure. So the figures would be thinner because of this and the overall shrinkage would also be greater as the figure would have to cool off through a greater temperature range.
[…]“I assume that the overall height of the figures is correct. If this is so then my theory of the hotter metal is probably right, as the general overall cooling shrinkage is compensated for in the plane of the figure ( i.e. its height )by the flattening effect of the extra pressure[…]i can also tell you that they do not use the same metal that I use for Phaeton. The shrinkage in my metal is ZERO.

I won’t copy here his “not very kind words” about what the factory has done, but if his theory proves correct he will be VERY upset… he intends to call the factory and discuss those matters first time on monday…
June 30, 2013 at 7:51 am #28199
Thingol
Participant
…. hm ! It will be interesting to see their response…
June 30, 2013 at 9:22 am #28200
Gildor
MMP Elder
well I received an answer from Chris today after having sent him pics, as I thought, the pictures are not enough to feel and see the difference, on monday, he’ll ask for sample castings (which he NEVER gets from mithril… so he was, as always, not aware about the final product problems… you may remember it has happened many times in the past.)

I also told him Xenophile, Thingol and Barliman were discussing this shrinking matter , he told me to publish his comments about Xenophile so I pass them here
I value ( and always have valued) Tom Wilkinson’s opinions on such matters. My annoyance at the Arkenstone problem has been somewhat offset by learning that he is a member of the Mithril community. I owe him a great deal. He was a key founder of Mithril and without him I doubt whether I would have achieved the `Mithril “look” and certainly not the casting quality.
June 30, 2013 at 9:31 am #28201
Gildor
MMP Elder
I also took the opportunity to check the three different metals PA is using (and selling) :

cheaper is : Standard metal (65% Lead / 2% Antimony / 33% Tin) melts at 210°C Cast at 320-340°C.

best quality (according to them is : Model Metal (54% Lead / 11% Tin / 35% Bismuth) melts at 138°C Cast at 300-320°C.

lead-free metal (more expensive) is: 5 Star Metal (94.5% Tin / 3% Zinc / 2.5% Antimony) melts at 230°C
Cast at 320-340°C

I hope they did not choose standard metal, it would be a.. pity to say the least… and though I doubt they are dumb enough to use 5 star metal because of “lead free”, it is BOTH more expensive and uses a higher melt/casting point making it harder to cast… and may generate shrinkage?

If I remember well,
– bismuth is used to lower the melting point and for its malleability
– antimony is used for its hardness and capacity to reproduce small details but has a HIGH melting point (but there is none in “model metal…)
– zinc is a cheap metal with low fusion point but good melting capacity… but it generates shrinkage… and other problems such as misruns and cold shuts… and it is used in 5 metal, along with antominy)

Conserind those figurines are shrinked but the details are excellent… the more I think about it the more I think they have been using 5 star metal instead of Model Metal (maybe because they were out of stock of model metal at some point in the past… I think to remember they were out of stock of model metal, some months ago…)

that would be a pity…. not only considering 5 star is more expensive … but also if they use the casting technique used for Model,.. but they use 5 star…. and do not inject casting metal to counter the effect of shrinking during cooldown.
June 30, 2013 at 9:55 am #28202
Barliman
Participant
Since they’ve recently been producing smaller Ogres and Ents in – I presume – an attempt to use less metal and thereby make a financial saving, it certainly seems unlikely that they would then use a more expensive metal. Hmmmm, unless that was why they wanted to use less metal in the first place, so that they could afford the 5 star metal?

Could this all be part of a marketing decision, in order to eventually be able to state that Mithril figures are lead-free?
June 30, 2013 at 10:28 am #28203
Gildor
MMP Elder
did they ever say their figurines were lead free?

besides, smaller ogres and ents , in “size” does not seem to be a shrink matter… but using 5 star metal for their casting instead of Model would be paradoxal with their own marketing arguments concerning metal sales…
besides, using 5 star metal would not be a problem if… they respect the fact the metal shrinks and adapt the casting technique in accordance, which they seem not to do…
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